403 lines
17 KiB
Plaintext
403 lines
17 KiB
Plaintext
From: Digestifier <Linux-Development-Request@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu>
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To: Linux-Development@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu
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Reply-To: Linux-Development@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu
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Date: Fri, 23 Sep 94 15:13:14 EDT
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Subject: Linux-Development Digest #213
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Linux-Development Digest #213, Volume #2 Fri, 23 Sep 94 15:13:14 EDT
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Contents:
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Re: Multiprocessing Pentium Systems (Mark Bolzern)
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Re: Don't use Linux?! (Mark Bolzern)
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Re: Don't use Linux?! (Mark Bolzern)
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Re: Don't use Linux?! (Mark Bolzern)
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Re: Porting applications to TERM (Olaf Titz)
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Re: XFig Eats All My Memory. (pj04781)
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Re: COBOL for Linux (James Fidell)
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Re: Linux on CD (Stefan Taferner)
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Re: [STATUS] Linus Floppy Driver Development (Dominik Kubla)
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----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From: mark@gcs.com (Mark Bolzern)
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Subject: Re: Multiprocessing Pentium Systems
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Date: Thu, 22 Sep 1994 22:39:22 GMT
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In article <1994Sep6.211029.11082@news.cs.indiana.edu>,
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David Williams <dwwillia@mango.ucs.indiana.edu> wrote:
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>
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>I've just seen some new dual processor pentium systems in Computer
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>Shopper. They look swell for the money, but there isn't a single OS
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>that can take advantage of them. Anybody have any thoughts about how
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>hard it might be to make Linux one of the first OS's to take advantage
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>of these systems?
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Not quite true... SCO MPX will work with many of them. But it would still
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be good to have Linux available......
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--
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Mark Bolzern : mark@gcs.com USA Tel: (303) 699-7470 Fax: (303) 699-2793
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WorkGroup Solutions, Inc. The FlagShip "CA-Clipper and XBase on Unix" People
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FlagShip is a 4GL Database Development System & XBase Porting Tool for Unix
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No Runtime Fees Info at ftp.wgs.com : /pub2/wgs/Filelist OR mail: info@wgs.com
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------------------------------
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From: mark@gcs.com (Mark Bolzern)
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Subject: Re: Don't use Linux?!
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Date: Thu, 22 Sep 1994 23:16:05 GMT
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In article <34pq45INNojt@sbusol.rz.uni-sb.de>,
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Michael Schumacher <hightec@sbusol.rz.uni-sb.de> wrote:
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>
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>Hello Linuxers!
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>
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>Okay. Before you start sending me endless flames, I want to make sure
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>that you know that I *love* Linux. It's probably the best PC Un*x you
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>can find between here and the sun. Linux has some nice features, e.g.
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>the /proc filesystem, it is fast, it supports lots of hardware, it
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>follows the POSIX standard (which makes porting of existing software
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>much easier), plus: it's free. Nobody knows the exact number of Linux
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>installations, but it's likely to be in the 100000's. One could think
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>that companies are willing to consider Linux a reasonable and serious
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>platform, and that they would port and offer their products to the
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>Linux community. However, they are far away from doing so, actually.
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While I agree and disagree in varying amounts with the rest of this message
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I would like to take agree with the above, in general, but object to the
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statement that NO commercial companies have or will port their products..
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What are we? Chopped Liver?
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WorkGroup Solutions and Multisoft have taken the plunge by porting FlagShip
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which is the Unix version of the CA/Clipper language from the DOS world.
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There are tons of commercial software packages written in Clipper (Possibly
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as many as all other languages put together), and all of these are now
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a simple compile away from Linux.
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There is a huge aftermarket for Clipper written products and add ons. Clipper
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is powerful enough to emulate Fox & Dbase ... the premise behind our FoxKit..
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FlagShip may be the key to bringin Linux to 200+ K Clipper programmers,
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Millions of users of Clipper written programs, and about 20 million Dbase &
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Foxers.....
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FlagShip sells for thousands of dollars on "Commercial" Unix systems, and we
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have thousands of installations.
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We are gambling that Linuxers want DOS pricing levels, and offer our
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Linux product inexpensively enough to qualify for this designation.
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We are also working at convincing other commercial vendors to take the
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plunge............
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What is missing? THE SUPPORT FROM THE LINUX COMMUNITY
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You want your OS to be to MicroSoft, as MicroSoft was to IBM (It's undoing)?
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The democratic solution to a potential Gates Dictatorship?
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Then you need to get behind, buy, try and talk about the commercial packages
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that take the risk to jump into Linux early. It is buyers that allow
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commercial development to happen.... it is great commercial products,
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preferably clones & supersets of what is presently in use that will be bought,
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and then the circle continues as products, no longer limited by the OS
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get better & better.
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If you want to check us out... see below... If you don't... at least support
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the concept. I personally believe that Linux IS the next computer revolution.
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--
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Mark Bolzern : mark@gcs.com USA Tel: (303) 699-7470 Fax: (303) 699-2793
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WorkGroup Solutions, Inc. The FlagShip "CA-Clipper and XBase on Unix" People
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FlagShip is a 4GL Database Development System & XBase Porting Tool for Unix
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No Runtime Fees Info at ftp.wgs.com : /pub2/wgs/Filelist OR mail: info@wgs.com
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------------------------------
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From: mark@gcs.com (Mark Bolzern)
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Subject: Re: Don't use Linux?!
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Date: Thu, 22 Sep 1994 23:25:12 GMT
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In article <JKVG.94Sep9231859@kamet.ccs.neu.edu>,
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Jagadeesh Krishnamurthy Venugopal <jkvg@kamet.ccs.neu.edu> wrote:
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>
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> 2. Linux's libc tends to change its version number almost every week
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> (sometimes even more often). Even though changes of the minor
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> version number should not affect previous applications, they will
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> sometimes break them. This means for a company that they have to
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> debug the library in order to find a work-around (see 3.).
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>
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>[Lotsa stuff deleted]
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>Two points
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>
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>1) Linux is of the hackers, by the hackers, for the hackers. There is
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>absolutely no need to make it commercially successful. In the search for
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>commercial success I am afraid we might lose track of the original ideal-- a
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>free os which is the hacker's dream. Well if one wants commercially available
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>releases of UNIX there are plenty-- UnixWare, Solaris, etc. Let us have Linux
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>just for us. Once the commercial market is aimed at, technical advances get
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>sacrificed at the altar of compatability (Consider that the largest selling OS
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>today is the most wretched). It would be a sad day for Linux if it happened.
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Boy, how shortsighted can you possibly get? Commercial success will not hurt
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linux a bit, and may very well help it out a lot. The point in creating art,
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in making computers, and computers better is to share them with those not
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as skilled. By all means preserve the open development, and the primarily
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for hackers... no problem..... but it is paychecks that allows one to eat,
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and money makes the world go round...... If linux works for commercial
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entities, the hackers will have that much more reason to hack.... and see
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their art enjoyed by the masses... the ultimate reward.
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You can always have compatiblity for some time, and have radical departures
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in the development.... and then upgrade from 1.0 to 2.0... everyone has to
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recompile or whatever to run on 2.0... so what.... if it is of a major enough
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benefit.... then maybe include a compatibiity module... there is always some
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one to do these compatibility things.... no one says you have to... by all
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explore what you can do and hack your heart out..
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Power to the people... that is what Linux is, and should stay.... and in the
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process become very successful commercially as well... not in spite of what
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it is, but because of what it is, By hackers, For Hackers, and also for
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the underpriviledged that need a true standard that no one entity controls.
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--
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Mark Bolzern : mark@gcs.com USA Tel: (303) 699-7470 Fax: (303) 699-2793
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WorkGroup Solutions, Inc. The FlagShip "CA-Clipper and XBase on Unix" People
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FlagShip is a 4GL Database Development System & XBase Porting Tool for Unix
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No Runtime Fees Info at ftp.wgs.com : /pub2/wgs/Filelist OR mail: info@wgs.com
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------------------------------
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From: mark@gcs.com (Mark Bolzern)
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Subject: Re: Don't use Linux?!
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Date: Thu, 22 Sep 1994 23:40:03 GMT
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In article <1994Sep13.142347.25281@cs.cornell.edu>,
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Matt Welsh <mdw@cs.cornell.edu> wrote:
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>In article <34pq45INNojt@sbusol.rz.uni-sb.de> hightec@sbusol.rz.uni-sb.de (Michael Schumacher) writes:
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>>installations, but it's likely to be in the 100000's. One could think
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>>that companies are willing to consider Linux a reasonable and serious
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>>platform, and that they would port and offer their products to the
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>>Linux community. However, they are far away from doing so, actually.
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>>Here's why:
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>
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>I have to agree with most of your observations. This was a
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>well-thought-out article.
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>
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>> Quo vadis, Linux? Do we continue to like Linux "as is", or should we
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>>change something in order to encourage companies to develop commercial, but
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>>sophisticated end-user software for this beautiful OS? Do we continue to
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>>keep Linux a powerful tool for wizards only, or do we want to see Linux
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>>being used in offices and other commercial environments? If we *really*
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>>want Linux to succeed, we *need* the companies and their commercial products!
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>
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>This is one of the goals of Linux International, a nonprofit organization
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>which is currently forming. A number of Linux developers, such as Michael
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>Johnson, Alan Cox, and Ian Murdock are working with Linux International in
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>order to promote the development and growth of Linux. One of LI's goals is
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>to lobby commercial software developers to release products for Linux.
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>
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>This is not LI's only goal, of course. Another focus is to support the
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>Linux developers themselves, by helping to direct donations and funding.
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>My concept has been to form a "grant fund" where people can send donations
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>to support Linux development. People who wish to develop software for
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>Linux (such as new device drivers, applications, and so forth) and require
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>funding (to purchase equipment, documentation, etc.) can make a
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>grant request. Grants will be awarded out of the pool of donations sent
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>to this fund.
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>
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>This seems to be the only way to manage donations for Linux development.
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>With all due respect, it doesn't make a great dceal of sense to send
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>your money just to Linus Torvalds or Patrick Volkerding. Scores of
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>others have spent as much time working on Linux over the last two
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>years. You could always support the FSF, which does, in fact, support Linux.
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>But what about people developing the Linux kernel? And the many others not
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>affiliated directly with the FSF? Because the Linux "development team" is so
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>disorganized, a grant fund seems to be the best way to go.
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>
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>There's no organization behind Linux. LI is not an attempt to form one.
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>It is just an attempt to promote the growth of Linux through aiding
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>developers.
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>
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>LI is still in the planning stage, but watch c.o.l.* and Linux Journal
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>for more details.
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>
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>M. Welsh
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GO for it MATT !!!! You've got my vote... And some of my wallet.
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--
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Mark Bolzern : mark@gcs.com USA Tel: (303) 699-7470 Fax: (303) 699-2793
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WorkGroup Solutions, Inc. The FlagShip "CA-Clipper and XBase on Unix" People
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FlagShip is a 4GL Database Development System & XBase Porting Tool for Unix
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No Runtime Fees Info at ftp.wgs.com : /pub2/wgs/Filelist OR mail: info@wgs.com
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------------------------------
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From: uknf@rzstud1.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de (Olaf Titz)
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Crossposted-To: comp.protocols.misc
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Subject: Re: Porting applications to TERM
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Date: 22 Sep 1994 17:15:12 GMT
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Richard L. Goerwitz <goer@midway.uchicago.edu> wrote:
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> In article <CwHnux.np@news.tudelft.nl> stock@dutsh7.tudelft.nl (Robert Stockmann) writes:
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> >I think its amazing! does that mean that also smail/sendmail can be compiled
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> >with term within? how can you than receive email if your term pc is
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> >not registered with a valid hostname?
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Receive - not. Send - yes, but the receiving end will see the mail
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coming from the other, Internet-connected end of your term host.
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> Not only unregistered, but also lacking a full networking installation -
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> will it work then? Typically software I've tried to run can't determine
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> my hostname, and aborts, even though I have a rudimentary identification
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> for my system in /etc/HOSTNAME.
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You mean, software compiled with termnet? This is a bug in the termnet
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library, and is being fixed (look at my WWW page if curious).
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Olaf
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-
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All term-related stuff redirected to comp.protocols.misc.
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--
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___ olaf@bigred.ka.sub.org - uknf@rz.uni-karlsruhe.de
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__ o <a href="http://rzstud1.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de/~uknf/">click</a>
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__/<_ also: s_titz@ira.uka.de - uknf@dkauni2.bitnet - praetorius@irc
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_)>(_)_________ "now i find that most of the time love's not enough in itself"
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------------------------------
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From: pj04781@austin.lockheed.com (pj04781)
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Subject: Re: XFig Eats All My Memory.
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Date: 23 Sep 1994 09:30:57 -0500
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In article <35p80m$afc@news.ed.ray.com>,
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Russell E. Dube <russ@wpc18.ed.ray.com> wrote:
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>Lucas James Sheneman (sheneman@cs.uidaho.edu) wrote:
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>: I am running Linux 1.1.49, XF86_VGA (from XFree86-2.1.1). When I run
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>: xfig, it rapidly eats up all of my available memory and never actually
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>: pops up. I have 20MB RAM and 25MB swap.
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>
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>FWIW, I have the same problem with 1.0.9 and Slackware 2.0. Eats my
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>available memory (16M machine), never pops up. Please post since
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>undoubtedly others have a need to know. Thanks in advance.
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>Russ Dube -- My opinions, not those of my employer ...
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I've never tried running xfig on my linux machine at home, but I do know
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that it takes 30 seconds to a minute to start on a Sun Sparc with 32 megs
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and starts in less than 5 seconds on a Sparc with 64 megs of ram. It is
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a memory pig and swaps like crazy starting up on the 32 meg machine.
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Granted, the OS takes up a lot more room on the Sun's, but even the CAD
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and simulation packages here take up less memory to start.
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You might try closing all other windows first and/or increasing swap to
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get it to run. It is a nice package.
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Personal opinions,
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frank
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--
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Frank G. Smith (frank@austin.lockheed.com) Help eradicate huge sigs.
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------------------------------
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From: jfid@mfltd.co.uk (James Fidell)
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Subject: Re: COBOL for Linux
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Date: 23 Sep 1994 17:50:06 +0100
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In article <35qfpg$3ig@oddball.sjc.MENTORG.COM>, ewill@wv.mentorg.com (Eric Williams @ PCB x5577) writes:
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> Does anyone know of a freeware COBOL for Linux? [*]
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The COBOL FAQ covers this fairly well.
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James.
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--
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"Yield to temptation -- |
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it may not pass your way again" | jfid@mfltd.co.uk
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- Lazarus Long | James Fidell
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------------------------------
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From: staferne@risc.uni-linz.ac.at (Stefan Taferner)
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Subject: Re: Linux on CD
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Date: 23 Sep 1994 11:06:36 GMT
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>>Its alright as a way to look at UNIX, maybe, for a brief period, but
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>>TOTALLY unstatisfactory for doing real work.
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>
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>Much as I hate to, I feel I have to disagree with you there. It depends how
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>much RAM you have - if you have enough to provide a reasonable size cache and
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>prevent demand paged binaries from becoming non-resident then it is a
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>different ball game. It is probably best to have some of the distribution on
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>the faster hard drive, agreed, but you were being a bit slating about the
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>concept. It is workable.
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I think it is a question of money. If you have enough money to install
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so much RAM you probably also have enough to buy a 200meg HD to install
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Linux on it. Sure, for real work you need more space, but just for
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the system it would be enough.
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To have enough memory for a large disk cache you need approx. 8MB,
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which cost the same as a 200MB hard disk (at least here in Austria).
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Greetings, Stefan
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--
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Stefan Taferner, RISC Linz, Austria | Hardware, n.: The parts of a computer
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email: staferne@risc.uni-linz.ac.at | system that can be kicked
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------------------------------
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From: kubla@goofy.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (Dominik Kubla)
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Subject: Re: [STATUS] Linus Floppy Driver Development
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Date: 23 Sep 1994 14:53:58 GMT
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In article <35ukmi$ccd@usenety1.news.prodigy.com> davidsen@usenety1.news.prodigy.com (Bill Davidsen) writes:
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In article <CwJ7yy.D07@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU>,
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Larry Doolittle <doolittle@cebaf.gov> wrote:
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Or you could put it in the floppy driver and make it loadable.
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I'm about 80% sure the floppy driver is a loadable one, I just
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don't have a system handy to check.
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No, it is not. The QIC-117 (aka 'Floppy tape') driver is a KLM. And making
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the floppy driver a KLM is not possible (or at least difficult):
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How would you create a boot floppy without having a driver in the kernel at
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boot time ...
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Cheers,
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Dominik
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--
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===========================================================================
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eMail: Dominik.Kubla@Uni-Mainz.DE sMail: Dominik Kubla, Lannerstrasse 53
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55270 Ober-Olm, F.R. of Germany
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>>> Save the environment NOW! <<< ****** European Union ******
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------------------------------
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** FOR YOUR REFERENCE **
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The service address, to which questions about the list itself and requests
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to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, is:
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Internet: Linux-Development-Request@NEWS-DIGESTS.MIT.EDU
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You can send mail to the entire list (and comp.os.linux.development) via:
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Internet: Linux-Development@NEWS-DIGESTS.MIT.EDU
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Linux may be obtained via one of these FTP sites:
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nic.funet.fi pub/OS/Linux
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tsx-11.mit.edu pub/linux
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sunsite.unc.edu pub/Linux
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End of Linux-Development Digest
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******************************
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